They do lead, and they do a lot of important things. Countries wouldnt run without systems of government, most things wouldnt run without leaders taking care of them. Whether they do it well or not, they're there, and we have to deal with it.
They do lead, and they do a lot of important things. Countries wouldnt run without systems of government, most things wouldnt run without leaders taking care of them. Whether they do it well or not, they're there, and we have to deal with it.
Im from holland and we live in a democraty, that means there is one queen, but she has nothing to say, and there is a parlement, who are all split up in a party with diffrent names. the elextions show us which 3 of all the groups will lead the countrey ( the first chamber) and the ones who are left from the second chamber. so it is in fact the people who are chosing there rights.. but there is one prim minister balkendende ( iiiew, i hate him) who takes the wrong dissisioins. ( like bush) so he lead- and he is wrong so he can go.
I am the roring rampage of revenge
And? Leaders are still important. I live in a democracy as well, and leaders are still needed to get things done. I agree we could do without Bush as a leader, but we still need a leader. I cant really understand the rest of what you said, sorry.
Was he a relative of Vincent?
Mr Thou! Mr Thou!
okay leaders are needed, but they have to listen the people.. not just think whats good for there own. and come on leaders are so easily so corrupt. in holland its diffrent...we cont chambers.. with many party's ( maybe its parties i dont know , but not parties like a fest) there a group of people who where chosen by the us..
and you have right and left..partys..and in between offcourse.. example:
a party called D66= left which means their goal is to help all people rich and poor , they thing we must help eachother and they as a gouverment much help the people with hospital care ( or something)
a right party VVD says= no we have to be a free land , the people can take care of themselves. no interfearing by gouverment.
@MATTY PIE: balkenende = our prim minister( not a good one)
I am the roring rampage of revenge
Who? I was talking about Theo Van Gogh...Originally Posted by Trinity
@MATTY PIE: balkenende = our prim minister
Mr Thou! Mr Thou!
ooh he= really was a man with a mouth.. he insulted people many people and called the islam... a bunch of dutch= geiten neuker translated means goaters.. so it wasnt really smart of him, but he had a oppinion. and we are the land of free oppinions ( until now i quess) but also towards christains he was not nice.. but it is never a reason to kill someone like this ( shot and stabbed twice)
I am the roring rampage of revenge
I'm from Antwerp, Belgium and the aftermath of Van Gogh's murder is noticeable here. As you might or might not know, Antwerp has a large number of immigrants, about 75 % of which are Arabs and/or Muslims (the other 25 % probably being the Dutch). In my school, the Muslim kids are running around showing how great it is Van Gogh was killed, while the right-wing kids are doing the opposite thing. Violence is rampant. The parking lot of my school has become the scene for weekly riots between Arabs and commies on the left side, and neo-fascists on the right. There doesn't seem to be a middle lane for the youths in Belgium. Only last week, two Jews were killed in the streets, seperate cases. I don't like it one bit.
As you also might or might not know, Vlaams Blok, the Belgian extreme right-wing party, gets about 30 % of the votes; that's an awful lot for a country where six parties are considered to be big.
Theo Van Gogh was a provocative man, indeed. He said harsh things about Muslims that were a bit distasteful, but he never meant them any harm. Heck, the major part of the cast for 'Submission' (the film that got him killed) was Arab. But what Van Gogh tried to provoke, was discussion, not action. I believe he was a very peaceful man.
I think both Belgium and Holland are in an uncomfortable situation right now, what with extreme right-wing parties being so popular in both countries, and the murder on individuals like Pim Fortuyn and Theo Van Gogh in Holland.
lol @ people using the term "middle eastern" and "Muslim" interchangeably.
As for Van Gogh, what happened to him was wrong. However, all he ever tried to do was provoke conflict. And then he begged for his life before he died.
Another thing. Not all Arabs are Muslim!!! It's like saying all white people are catholic.
I'm European and Muslim for proof.
Yes, great great grand nephew, or something like that.
I also live in Holland, and I've noticed no discrimination against muslims since the murder of Van Gogh. On the contrary, Balkenende refused to send his condolences to the family of the victim, as he was busy visiting a mosque and a burned down islamic school. His government proposed toughening up the laws against blasphemy, so that no-one else could say "my god is a pig, I call him allah" (famous Van Gogh quote) any more. If you ask me, those murdering jihad psychos have won.
As for Theo, I always was a great fan of his weekly columns in the "metro". I also agree with his opinions about these wive-beating homophobic antisemitic zealots who are endangering everything Europe has achieved in centuries of revolutions, reforms and wars. By the way, he just called religious fanatics geitenneukers, not everyone who happens to be muslim.
Last edited by Nemesis the Warlock; 12-29-2004 at 02:28 PM.
To do is to be. (Sokrates)
To be is to do. (Sartre)
Do be do be do. (Sinatra)
Actually taking steps to curb blatant racism like that was a responsible action. People are not born hating others. If Dutch Muslims were raised in an environment where they constantly face comments which make them feel like crap, how do you think they would view people who are not just like them? Alienation radicalizes people, whether that be on a religious or secular level.
Eliminating causes of hatred in a country may seem like "giving in" to a few radicial elements in a certain faction, but in the long run it will be seen as using reason and logic.
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