Eyes on Final Fantasy Forums > The World Is Square...and Enix > Heart (and Body) of the Kingdom of Kingdom Hearts > The Nature of Kingdom Hearts

[Tavrobel]

Originally Posted by Ouch! ^

Perhaps a bit of a side note, but they're apparently called Unversed now (Nomura says it was a poor translation; more like he changed his mind) and they somehow spawn from negative emotions.

Interesting change. But, if they're spawned from negative emotions, what exactly does that mean they form from? Last I checked, emotions were a matter of the Heart.

KHII isn't complicated because of the stuff involved. It suffers from RTFM syndrome (Ansem Reports). If we started comparing the depth of KH games to FF games, we'd find a very suitable match in difficulty.

[Roogle]

Originally Posted by Khalin ^

... but it sounds like normal inconsistencies that a lot of games/series like this have. It certainly wouldn't be the first time. This is why I'm always pleasantly surprised when a story of any kind manages to stay extremely consistent and includes a large degree of connection.

I agree. I hope that the scenario writers find a better way to explain Kingdom Hearts. One would think that special care would be taken for the titular plot point of the series...

[Ouch!]

Originally Posted by Tavrobel ^

Originally Posted by Ouch! ^

Perhaps a bit of a side note, but they're apparently called Unversed now (Nomura says it was a poor translation; more like he changed his mind) and they somehow spawn from negative emotions.

Interesting change. But, if they're spawned from negative emotions, what exactly does that mean they form from? Last I checked, emotions were a matter of the Heart.

From what I've seen, it's unclear so far. Given that Nomura has confirmed that Heartless (and so by extension Nobodies) do not exist in Kingdom Hearts: Birth by Sleep, the common consensus seems to be that the Unversed are somehow the prototypical heartless. The most recent Famitsu article on Birth by Sleep said that Eraqus (the origin of the keyblade master's name is, in fact, merely an anagram of square) suspects Master Xehanort is involved as his disappearance coincides with the appearance of the Unversed.

[Wolf Kanno]

Unversed means "Those who are not well versed in their own existence" and according to the Kingdom Heart's wiki they only "grow off of negative emotion" which I might interpret as meaning they are drawn and grow from the emotions of people. They are also suppose to be the "opposite of life".

I would guess they are possible the original form of the Heartless and Nobodies. By that, I mean a creature spawned from darkness that may have lost their heart but did not go through the process of splitting into a Heartless and Nobody rather it being a Heartless that may have kept their body however warped.

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Here's another debate I've pondered with people is whether or not Riku has a Nobody. He was possessed by the Heartless Ansem but its never stated if Ansem consumed Riku's heart like a normal Heartless. Do you think Riku qualified for a Nobody? Is it possible he might have a special nobody like Roxas or Namine? Just a simply debate I got into and sense we're kinda discussing unexplained phenomena already its fine to debate.

[black orb]

>>> No offence to the KH fans but remember that this is a game that mix FF with Disney characters, in other words you cant even take this game seriously..

BTW
I played the original KH game but i didnt have the stomach to finish it so I made my little brother beat it for me (atleast he enjoyed it)..

[The Summoner of Leviathan]

I don't think Riku ever "lost" his heart like Sora or Kairi did. As far as I am aware and from what I recall, Riku was always present in Xehanort's Heartless. Actually, I think it would be more appropriate to understand it as Riku being possessed by Xehanort's Heartless than Riku actually losing his heart.

:O They are called Unversed now? Interesting. It also gave me an idea! From what was said, I assume Unversed are predecessors of Heartless and Nobodies. They also feed on negative emotions. So maybe Heartless and Nobodies came to being when an Unversed "ate" (for the lack of better word) all the negative emotions of a given being. The Unversed, filled with the negative emotions becomes a Heartless while its prey, emptied of its negative emotions, becomes a Nobody? Though the only problem with this is what happened to the positive emotions? Unless somehow those are consumed when the Unversed becomes a Heartless since Heartless feeds on hearts. Anyways, just a theory that came to me. Not well thought out. :x

Maybe Kingdom Hearts is not a constant? It only arises when hearts start to gather. It always seemed to be something rather abstract given physical form than having any permanent, concrete existences of its own. :/

[Tavrobel]

Originally Posted by black orb ^

>>> No offence to the KH fans but remember that this is a game that mix FF with Disney characters, in other words you cant even take this game seriously..

Then you could also apply that logic to any work of art with a story ever. Please, tell that to my Literature professor so that I don't have to do anything in that class other than skip it. I suppose I shouldn't learn from Aladdin that if I happen to chance upon fortunes, that I should not take them for granted, and that I shouldn't use that fortune solely for the sake of some tail. I should also not yell at my pet monkey or any supernatural entities that can't kill me, but also the same entities that can make my life miserable.

Originally Posted by Wolf Kanno ^

Here's another debate I've pondered with people is whether or not Riku has a Nobody. He was possessed by the Heartless Ansem but its never stated if Ansem consumed Riku's heart like a normal Heartless. Do you think Riku qualified for a Nobody? Is it possible he might have a special nobody like Roxas or Namine? Just a simply debate I got into and sense we're kinda discussing unexplained phenomena already its fine to debate.

TSoL's answer is correct: Riku never became a Heartless. He was just a jerk. He didn't really lose anything other than control.

As for the Unversed, I figured that they would follow the pattern of parts that constitute a person that remain unused. But seeing as how Heartless didn't exist before KHI (according to the Ansem Reports), I supposed that the Unversed would be there to fill that void. Gotta have something to fight. I don't think that Unversed would "turn into" a Heartless or a Nobody after a certain point. If we applied an evolutionary approach, then we should have seen Unversed in KHI and KHII (very definitely KHII).

Either way, I don't see Unversed finally turning into a Heartless after consuming all of the negative emotions possible. Riku and Sora at certain points would have compromised themselves if that were the case. Plus, not all Heartless are malicious or inherently violent. White Mushrooms and Truffles don't attack people for the sake of attacking. I didn't sense negativity when I juggled them in the air.

[Ouch!]

Originally Posted by Tavrobel ^

As for the Unversed, I figured that they would follow the pattern of parts that constitute a person that remain unused. But seeing as how Heartless didn't exist before KHI (according to the Ansem Reports), I supposed that the Unversed would be there to fill that void. Gotta have something to fight. I don't think that Unversed would "turn into" a Heartless or a Nobody after a certain point. If we applied an evolutionary approach, then we should have seen Unversed in KHI and KHII (very definitely KHII).

Nomura, being fairly liberal with information, has already confirmed that Unversed no longer exist by the time of Kingdom Hearts. The reason is unclear.