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#57  Be fair... There's no 'evidence' that he DIDN'T die and was brought back to life... Some would say on more than one occassion... Look, kids, the ending, helled-horrors, this whole game is open to suggestive interpretation. There's not obvious answers because it was poorly executed. If it was developed better, there wouldn't have been the initial disapproving disbelief when the "Oh, I forgot because of the GFs" scene occurred. This in turn leads people off to making assumptions and hunting for 'evidence' to simply... SUPPORT THEIR INTERPRETATIONS... So, let's drop it. We can agree to disagree. You don't have to DEBATE to discuss this fantasy game with a story that leaves more questions than answers. Hell, there are people making of theories of why was Locke Cole's face not shown in the FMV Ending of Final Fantasy VI... Just drop it and if you all discuss TOGETHER instead of DEBATING each others you all might come to a consened conclusion. |
10-03-2006, 03:33 AM
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| | 'Squall did not die' does not need to be proven. It is the negative claim. 'Squall died and came back to life' is a positive claim, as is 'Squall died'. Positive claims need to be supported with evidence before you give them the time of day. ::Sigh:: Or there are the people who began from observation and tried to maintain the rational method in their analysis. Again, it only leaves more questions than answers because you refuse to apply Occam's razor and the rational method. REALITY leaves more questions than answers. It can still be analyzed And? They are also postulating wildly with nothing to stand on. Concensus is rarely a valid way of coming to an empirical conclusion. Geocentric models of the universe, anyone? |
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10-03-2006, 04:13 AM
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| Banned | This has GOT to END... Ryushikaize... I'm trying to bring some sort of amelioration to these discussions because all they seem to do is wind up being is closed. I DON'T want to get into a fight with you. I really don't... But most of the time... All you ever seem to do is post REJECTION to anything anyone says to the matter and NEVER post anything ORIGINAL to the subject matter. STOP DOING THAT!!! All it ever results in is flaming and name-calling. I swear to God, it's like you and yours only seem to LOOK for a fight and nothing else. Post something original, NOT a counter-post to other people, post your original thoughts on the subject matter. We were finally starting to get along and DISCUSS in that other thread about Guardian Forces and other mysteries, why stop there? As you saw, I tried to be FAIR on both sides of the discussion; not favoring for either or. And it's not just you Ryushikaize. I don't mean to single you out, but... I mean, OMG, it's never gonna fuggin' end, why are you people fighting over FANTASY... FANTASY... Even the MODS have been adamant about this when they close these threads... Just stop it. Ryushikaize, by you saying this: "::Sigh:: Or there are the people who began from observation and tried to maintain the rational method in their analysis. " It counters this, which you also said: "'Squall did not die' does not need to be proven. It is the negative claim. 'Squall died and came back to life' is a positive claim, as is 'Squall died'. Positive claims need to be supported with evidence before you give them the time of day." All that says is that you don't agree with it, because it interferes with YOUR interpretation, YOUR belief, YOUR "Opinion" is "Law". It's not. No one's is. I swear, you all sound like a bunch of "Religious Zealots"! You believe "This" but then someone else who believes otherwise either believes different, or that/you attack you/they and you/they have to "defend" your/their beliefs... It never ends. It's FANTASY, and no matter what "evidence" ANYONE comes up with, there is nothing but assumption and interpretation... The ending has the most confusing visuals ever and no audio to give a definiative explaination of the ending. Just like with FFVII.... Can you all PLEASE!!! PLEASE!!! Just get the fug along? There is no reason to put down anyone on this... GAME of how they interpreted it. Squall died; Squall didn't die; Squall died and Rinoa used her Soreceress Power to bring her back... It doesn't matter. The ideal, visuals, and vagueness of Time Compression and Sorceress Power leaves everything in this game/story open to speculation and therefore, there is no reason why people can't voice their views, opinions, and interpretations of how the ending occurred without getting into a "DEBATE" about it... It's Fantasy, and very poorly done in the tradition of Final Fantasy at that... Now everbody kiss, hug, do a little dance, and make a lot of angry-make up love, and get down tonight... (sigh)  |
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10-03-2006, 06:26 AM
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| | Well, there technically is a rule against these sorts of posts... Though I think most of these types of threads gets closed for being either completely nonproductive, or flaming occuring. No, it doesn't. When I speak of positive and negative claims, I refer to rational reductionism, and positive claims (this is so) must be supported, and if they cannot be, then the negative claim (this is not so) is favored by default. Observation says that since Squall is up and well after each incident, the chances of him dying are slim, and him dying and coming back is a rather extraordinary claim, for which there is no supporting evidence. Actually, since it has no evidence, it is disfavored in favor of a more parsimonious claim, in this case, the negative. Continuing the religious metaphor, what we are doing is the equivalent of asking someone for evidence that their flood myth, or claim about the composition of the cosmos (ex: perfect heavenly spheres) In a much lesser sense, all we have about reality is assumptions and interpretations. That does not keep us from coming up with the best guess. It is not my intent to put anyone down, save perhaps FE, about this game. I merely wish for them to back up their views with empirical data, and become frustrated when they do not. This I'll grant, but then again, most of what we do here doesn't really matter. And there's also no reason we cannot employ rational reductionism to those explanations, either. angry make up sex sounds incredibly akward, though I'm sure listening in would be worth a few chuckles. And that kind of posts, good child, are why these threads get closed. Care to apologize before a Mod wanders in? |
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10-03-2006, 02:36 PM
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 | Lying motion less and not breathing = DEAD it isn't a hint, it flat out obvious! |
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10-03-2006, 02:53 PM
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| Banned | Okay... Here's How We're Gonna Do This... How 'bout this? How about we discuss these varied interpretations. Instead of stating someone is infailiably wrong... We can try to see from each other's perspective... Now, the Squall dies and is revived by Rinoa version seems a likely occurance. Why? Well, with 'Love' there is often 'Tragedy' involved in a 'Love Story'... which I really did not feel in this story, but, I digress. In a Time Compressed World, a decaying one at that, no one can exist. I won't go into the hallucinations/memories/Ultimecia's Message 'theories' for now, but at any rate... It seems that Squall IS in the Flower Field as he promised but is not in time-sync with Rinoa... As the Time Compressed World decays, he dies, and Rinoa, as it seems to be demonstrated often, unconciously uses her Sorceress Power to 'find' Squall right behind her in the TC version of the flower field. Now seeing that Ultimecia could use Edea to bring stone statues to 'life' and various other phenomena, it does not seem too far fetched that she would be able to simutaneously bring herself and Squall OUT of the Decaying Time Compressed World (Flower Field) and bring Squall back to life. It may even be that Squall, trapped in the Decaying Time Compression, had 'ceased to exist' and by Rinoa bringing him 'back' he... 'existed'. I guess that would give some merit to Laguna's 'speech' of love and friendship to bind you back to the world you came from... Yeah... I like that... |
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10-03-2006, 04:40 PM
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