Eyes on Final Fantasy Forums > Final Fantasy: The Quickening > Final Fantasy VII > Final Fantasy VII: Advent Children > Thoughts of the movie

[Ishin Ookami]

Originally Posted by PontiusPilate

Originally Posted by The Unknown Guru

I think it was a great movie, like a combination of The Matrix and FF. Awesome graphics and action scenes. I want that arm thing that that one guy had sooooooo bad(the one with the level-up ring tone that Tifa fights)!

I think FF already ripped off the matrix enough (with the whole motorcycle action scene and the music) I think they should of focused more on the story and the characters since they were both incredibly well done in FF VII

You know, I dont MIND the ripping off. The wachowski's ripped off ghost in the shell, X, John Woo, and a variety of other asian genre's that only a niche audience outside of japan and/or hong kong have seen before. Thing is as wonky and uncomplete as the matrix storyline was by the time revolutions rolled around, I still felt the parts they ripped off from those genre's was done with a fairly consistant level of quality.

Problem with Advent is that it focuses so much on the "gee kids, isn't that cool" factor that they thought they could leave the quality out. They ripped off the style, but left the quality, the thoughtfulness, the inventiveness all behind. The cool factor only works if advent is the first time your seeing a guy flip with a motorcycle, shoot dual guns stylishly while flipping and kung fu fighting, seen chi blasts or vehicles thrown like tennis balls, or seen a hand to hand fight scene in the same genre's as tifa vs loz. I've seen ALL that. Ive seen it done DAMN well as well. Ive seen films where the final fight sequence involves shaolin monks come up with inventive ways too knock out the villains teeth to teach them a lesson, as well as a six way hand to staff to sword fight sequence directed and performed by living martial arts legends, with a story that is halfway involving as well. Compared to something like that, Advent isn't cool at all. It's actually rather cheesy and stupid.

[Amaru]

Have you seen all that in CGI? I believe the answer is no. Stop comparing ancient martial arts classics to a completely computer rendered project.

[Ishin Ookami]

Originally Posted by Amaru

Have you seen all that in CGI? I believe the answer is no. Stop comparing ancient martial arts classics to a completely computer rendered project.

If advent children wasn't trying (and failing spectacularly) to imitate martial arts classics, I wouldn't make the reference. Mayhap you should hit up some hk film websites and view some of the films AC is referencing.

Have I seen anything that compares to the sheer kick assery of Eight Diagram Pole Fighter in CGI, hell no. The film is a quarter century old and there are still few films that can match it's incredible, and 100% wirework free fight sequences. But have I seen other cool action sequences rendered in CGI? Hell yes. Macross Pluss and Appleseed both come to mind. Macross used a incredibly slick combo of CGI and cell animation while Appleseed was entirely CGI rendered using CGI and action sequences that Puts Advent Children to shame.

Thing with both of these films, is that they BOTH had a story that holds water, and had some logic and creativity to their action scenes making them more impactful. Advent isn't even at the cutting edge with their CGI (that would be arguably appleseed), which means they definitely could have used some good storytelling or choreography to make the film more absorbing. Like I said, the whole cool factor only works if you HAVN'T seen the genre's AC is imitating. if you have, then AC just comes off as a lame imitator. It's the Cinematic version of a bad elvis impersonator.

Impersonating the fat elvis.

Badly.

[Amaru]

In your opinion, your opinion isn't fact, no matter how much you dress it up. 9 out of 10 people who saw Advent Children were blown away by the CGI and the action sequences the first time that they saw it. Regardless of The Matrix or any other film that uses such a style. It's completely idiotic to compare the film's CGI sequences to martial arts classics with real life actors and martial arts skill. How in the world could it? CGI can never beat watching pure martial arts in motion. Furthermore, it is completely idiotic to compare a videogames movie at all to anything classic. The fact that you try to do so with Advent Children confuses me no end.

You can continue on this hate campaign of this movie all you like, but you aren't altering any one else's opinions.

[Ishin Ookami]

Originally Posted by Amaru

In your opinion, your opinion isn't fact, no matter how much you dress it up. 9 out of 10 people who saw Advent Children were blown away by the CGI and the action sequences the first time that they saw it.

Note the "first time" part of that statement. I can watch martial arts classics time and again, and still be entertained by the choreography, storytelling, and martial prowess of the stars. Ditto with Macross Plus, Appleseed, Spirits Within, and other CGI works. thats because they have something called storytelling and competent direction.

Also, using referencing group mentality to prove points is often a sign of an already shaky argument. Everyone I know hated advent Children. Even Square's premier hype magazine EGM bashed Advent Children's storytelling after seeing the film. But I dont need to reference anyone's opinions or thoughts to prove my own points or to say why I consider AC to be a poor film.

Regardless of The Matrix or any other film that uses such a style. It's completely idiotic to compare the film's CGI sequences to martial arts classics with real life actors and martial arts skill. How in the world could it? CGI can never beat watching pure martial arts in motion.

Not entirely true, martial arts anime manages to often be very absorbing. Dragonball Z and Rurouni Kenshin both come to mind as anime that manage to deliver martial arts entertainment that rivals the classics. That's because they both have storytelling and focus on martial principles rather then gee whiz cinematography ripped from other sources. When the storytelling is solid, and the choreography well thought out and interesting, martial art displays can work in ANY medium. Even early CGI works like Beast Wars and Reboot, managed to support some genuinely engrossing action sequences with lesser technology and funding.

Furthermore, it is completely idiotic to compare a videogames movie at all to anything classic. The fact that you try to do so with Advent Children confuses me no end.

That statement in itself is the definition of idiocy. Thats like saying different genre's or films based on novels or myth's should never compete at the Oscars. Advent Children is a movie, it will be judged as a movie, and it is a very poor one at that.

[Amaru]

Originally Posted by Ishin Ookami

Also, using referencing group mentality to prove points is often a sign of an already shaky argument.

Except, I'm not arguing anything here. Your opinion is simply that, your opinion, as is my own. I was simply stating that the majority of people were blown away by the action sequences in the film when they first saw it, clearly evident in the majority of opinions expressed on this very board, amongst others.

Everyone I know hated advent Children. Even Square's premier hype magazine EGM bashed Advent Children's storytelling after seeing the film. But I dont need to reference anyone's opinions or thoughts to prove my own points or to say why I consider AC to be a poor film.

Of course you don't need anyone else to back up your thoughts, as they are your thoughts.

Not entirely true, martial arts anime manages to often be very absorbing. Dragonball Z and Rurouni Kenshin both come to mind as anime that manage to deliver martial arts entertainment that rivals the classics.

Absorbing - yes, classic beating - absolutely not.

That's because they both have storytelling and focus on martial principles rather then gee whiz cinematography ripped from other sources.

Advent Children is not a Martial Arts film or falls anywhere in this filming genre.

When the storytelling is solid, and the choreography well thought out and interesting, martial art displays can work in ANY medium. Even early CGI works like Beast Wars and Reboot, managed to support some genuinely engrossing action sequences with lesser technology and funding.

Beast Wars featured inhuman CGI and Reboot never featured such amazingly human character likenesses or close-combat fighting as Advent Children.

That statement in itself is the definition of idiocy. Thats like saying different genre's or films based on novels or myth's should never compete at the Oscars. Advent Children is a movie, it will be judged as a movie, and it is a very poor one at that.

Movies based on videogames are the bottom of the literacy ladder. They are usually created soley for the fans. It is idiotic to compare them to classic films. Completely.

Whatever. I loved it for what it was, pure fanservice. It's a shame that others can't see and judge it as such.

[Ishin Ookami]

Originally Posted by Amaru

Whatever. I loved it for what it was, pure fanservice. It's a shame that others can't see and judge it as such.

Hey, Im one of those who let out a instinctual "wickedness" when X-3 gave us the cinematic incarnation of the fastball special. I dont mind fan service, but it helps to use some thought to the preceedings. The fastball special, a classic aspect of old school X-men itself, was backed up with referrences to classic X-story, days of future past. X-III also had the sense to involve some creativity and divergencies from the Dark Pheonix saga, and develop characters sperately from the comics. Thus it had fan service, but managed to be it's own incarnation at the same time. A fairly well written, acted, and filmed incarnation at that.

Advent Children however, not at all. What's the point of the intro? 498 years earlier eh? What was the point? The rest of the film followed suit. Sephiroth rising from the dead, Aerieth rising from the dead (multiple times), cloud rising from the dead. Nyah nyah, you cant kill us. The franchise is too successful, muahahahaha. All of that was basically the film masterbating over it's heritage, instead of celebrating it's roots as fan service tends to do.

[Noctiluca]

I think we all understand you hate the movie at this point